What autistic children need & Abuse
Posted by
Leanne
on 9th September 2010
at 15:50
Hi,
As a parent of 2 children on the spectrum and being married to someone who feels he may be on the spectrum any insight is always helpful and welcome :)
I do feel it is important though to emphasis that you are talking from your perspective as you and not for all autistic people.. I firmly believe that my 2 boys are individuals in their own right and react to situations differently because they are unique and their perspectives are unique. Everything that we do as parents with our children is tailored to them as individuals. Johnathon and Alistair constantly remind me that nothing to do with autism is set in stone.
As for dealing with the emotions of the answers I do understand your concerns because I have been there too.. I have lost count of the number of times my husband has told me to stop reading the posts because I do get very emotionally involved and he does remind me that every one is different and their way of dealing with things can be different to mine.. doesn't mean one way is right or wrong it is just different.
Leanne - Community Champion
Posted by
damo73
on 9th September 2010
at 16:21
Hello Elena and Ama,
Thanks for your thoughts Ama - I would agree with you on the points that you raise. I think when NT's talk about the 'needs' of autistic people, that this usually comes from concerned parents about their own children. Whether right or wrong in judgements made, this is quite understandable (as a parent, I too want to do what I think is 'best' for my child etc.). I am often less impressed by professionals who presume they know what autistic people 'need', often with little basis for such assumptions.
I completely agree with Ama that NT people lack a 'theory of mind' when considering autistic people. I think that all humans have difficulties understanding others. NT professionals will say that the social skills displayed by NT's place them at an advantage in this regard, yet I often see it as a disadvantage too. Many NT's are quick to make first impression judgements and biases, and make major mistakes (then again, we all can to some extent). My 'scientific' theory of mind, often sees things about people that others miss. However, as my perception is a minority one and labelled as a deficiency, my lack of certain social skills is seen as a problem for me (it often isn't). Traits such as deviousness, deception, gossiping etc. - I can quite happily live without. These traits are often seen as 'functional adaptations' by evolutionary psychologists, and my skills are often seen as deficits. Philosophically - I see it a double empathy problem based on 'phenomenological' (lived / perceptual) differences (how one perceives and experiences the world). This is not to say that NT's will understand other NT's and autistic people will understand other autistic people - however, I would argue that recognition of similarities are likely to be far higher within one's own sub-category. Also - the proof is 'in the pudding' - in my experience, I 'understand' the 'needs' of autistic people generally far better then NT needs, and also generally speaking get on with other autistic people better. At the basis of all of this is difference and diversity though, and full intrinsic understanding of being someone else is impossible to attain. Language (in all its forms) is a reduction of experience, to make elements of it accessible to others interpretations, and essentially, will always leave something out, especiallly that which is beyond words, of which we must remain silent (to paraphrase Wittgenstein).
It does baffle me though, in the sense of how NT's believe that they do have a good grasp of what others are thinking - when to me, it is obvious that they do not!!??!!?? Perhaps NT's do not deviate much from the mass/norm etc. - and therefore see much similarity, yet from an outlying perspective, this is not the case. For example - the more one deviates from the average, the more alone one is, in one's perceptions.
Anyway, I have probably over-complicated things, so will leave it there (leaving much beyond words!).
Damian - Community Champion
Posted by
damo73
on 9th September 2010
at 16:39
Hello Leanne,
Sorry - missed your post earlier. I think you are right to highlight the diversity of people on the spectrum (this fits with my philosophy which highlights the diversity of all people). Although perceptions can have similarities to others - and mine are generally more similar to others on the spectrum, and more removed from the views of some NT's in comparison to other NT's. For example - on this forum, I find myself agreeing a great deal with comments made by Sara, Amber, Micheal etc. - although I do agree with others too, this is less, and less relatable to. To talk of autism at all is to generalise about people on the basis of similarities (whether they are framed as advantages or disadvantages, differences or whatever).
I think that parents are in a good position (compared to professionals) in terms of contact and experience of a particular autistic person and in a number of contexts. They may not have the 'training', yet training can cause adherence to common misperceptions and stereotypes. Although, a parent can also struggle if their outlook is very different to their child's, or if they are not listening and imposing their own view of the world. I think having an autistic child will benefit these parents though in the long run, because it will show them that their way to think is not the only valid one to hold (hopefully!).
It all gets very complicated (well - at least in my head) - yet I'd agree that diversity is key here.
Damian - Community Champion
Posted by
Josie Barnshaw
on 9th September 2010
at 18:03
Hi Ama
This is exactly why I find the posts of Sara, Damian and now yourself so enlightening. Because my son and many others on the spectrum are at a different stage of ability as far as being able to vocalise their feelings or find the words to say that things we are saying, doing or asking them to do are causing them to feel the way that you describe.
For instance, I am decorating the house just now and only because I was chatting about different colours and things did Tom tell me how uncomfortable he felt in his room because not all the walls were the same colour .... there is just no way I would know this without him telling me that it was causing this discomfort to him.
Unless my son's actions or inactions can cause physical harm to himself or others then I tend to go with what is comfortable for him. A Like Damian, I have also found that "professionals" (in particular educators) are of the opinion that I should be doing more to get Tom to "fit into" the system. Obviously I dont agree with this, but find that my opinion really doesnt count for much as far as they are concerned!!
I would be really interested to hear what kind of things felt like abuse to you? It's these kind of insights that help us parents improve the way we interact with our kids.
Josie - Community Champion
Posted by
Josie Barnshaw
on 9th September 2010
at 18:04
Hi Again Ama
Meant to say that I agree with Elena that everyone is entitled to their opinion and therefore I would not take offence to anything that you or anyone else had to say.
Josie - Community Champion
Posted by
Blue Whale
on 9th September 2010
at 19:21
Hello
Thanks so much to all of you for your replies - you have give me much to think about, & made some really important points that are actually central to my own perspective.
I have had a long & very stressful day (but made some progress - fingers crossed), & also have computer problems that make it hard for me to write here at present. But tomorrow is another day, & hopefully it will be the day i get my computer back from repair shop so i can spend some time on here over the weekend when there is NO danger of professionals intruding on my space or my consciousness.
For now though i am going ot take a well-earned break for the evening & try to find a way to relax & take care of myself & even ENJOY myself.
I will be back soon. And am looking forward to it.
Love & Rainbows & Thanks to you all
Ama
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Posted by
Elena - former Community Manager
on 9th September 2010
at 14:29
Hello, Ama contacted me today and asked that I post this on her behalf. She was very careful not to cause any offense by this post, and I assured her that she has raised some valid points for discussion and that I'm sure no one will take offense.
Ama you are very kind to consider how words impact upon others! Thank you for your thoughtfulness. I hope you will soon see that in this particular discussion forum, we would not attack you for being wrong, or for having your own personal opinion. In fact all of us here have been wrong from time to time, and I don't believe anyone has ever gotten upset with someone else about it. But all of us definitely understand situations where people have been attacked! I personally see this often on Facebook, but in this environment (Talk about Autism) there is a strong level of respect and kindness.
So, on to Ama's topic!
Here's what she said:
What do you all think?